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Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:27 pm
by IVhorseman
That last bit is too true - have you seen the horse prices on bricklink?

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:41 pm
by Silverdream
IVhorseman wrote:That last bit is too true - have you seen the horse prices on bricklink?


Go to the lego store on a good day and buy a big PAB cup of horses.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:24 am
by Pwnerade
PAB horses are the greatest thing ever.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 8:40 pm
by aoffan23
I got to pick up nine white horses in a free PAB holiday box. Just... yes.

Anyway, while I was reading over the rules yesterday, I thought of something: why don't handcuffs just automatically make the captive a Submissive creature? Their skill will be dropped to 1d4, which makes sense, because handcuffs still leave your hands free. You can still perform actions, but your ability to do so is severely limited. Plus, no crits.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:31 am
by *CRAZYHORSE*
That's actually...a great idea.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 4:47 pm
by Keldoclock
Yeah, maybe we should put it into one of those grey box things and stick it on the Submissive Creature section.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:21 pm
by IVhorseman
Yeah, it's got my vote

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:44 pm
by Pwnerade
I like this plan. This could lead to humorous shenanigans from handcuffed minifigs attempting to fight or operate machinery. Whether their hands are cuffed behind the back or in the front should also affect their ability to do certain tasks.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 10:20 pm
by aoffan23
Yeah, it would be subject to heavy fudging and potential WISG rolls, but it's the simplest solution.

EDIT:
The 2010 Rules wrote:Under an intelligent minifig’s direction, the Creature may act as intelligently as if it had a full Mind, but if abandoned, the Creature reverts to whatever animal-like behavior seems appropriate: milling around aimlessly, running and hiding, or attacking everything in sight. If another intelligent minifig can catch a masterless Creature, regardless of whether he’s on the same team, the Creature accepts him as its new master.


This is perfect for when people are. When the captor is there, they control the captive. When the captor is dead or gone, the captive runs toward freedom. When an ally is with the captive, they can attempt to free them. I guess the roll for breaking handcuffs could just be a WISG roll.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:08 pm
by IVhorseman
How close would a captor have to be to maintain control? touching?

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:53 pm
by aoffan23
I'd say 2". There's always the possibility of holding a hostage at gunpoint, or even long prodding weapons like spears.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:56 pm
by IVhorseman
How about they have to be within attacking range? so someone with a gun trained on a captive could use the range of their weapon - as long as they could reasonably make an attack on the prisoner, the prisoner wouldn't dare disobey them. Would include melee weapons, and an unarmed master could still drag around a cuffed fig by hand.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 5:39 pm
by *CRAZYHORSE*
That sounds perfectly logical and simple. Now all that needs to happen is Stubs putting it in ( :twss: )

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 6:12 pm
by aoffan23
IVhorseman wrote:How about they have to be within attacking range? so someone with a gun trained on a captive could use the range of their weapon - as long as they could reasonably make an attack on the prisoner, the prisoner wouldn't dare disobey them. Would include melee weapons, and an unarmed master could still drag around a cuffed fig by hand.


The only issue with this is the fact that a sniper could take a hostage from across the battlefield. Even if the captive were to notice the red laser, he wouldn't have any idea what the sniper wanted him to do. That's why I like the 2" option.

The only issue with this is that a captive might be in a situation with both allies and enemies, in which case he would be contested. The easiest way to resolve this would be by looking at how many of each there are. Whichever force (meaning there could be contested control between allied forces) has the most minifigs within 2" of an unclaimed captive automatically gains control of them. If there is no greatest force in range of the captive, they remain unclaimed. A captive, like all Submissive creatures, remains claimed until its master is either gives up control willingly, or is killed or otherwise incapacitated.

This resolves the confusion of who has control of the captive in a scuffle, and allows for hostage missions.

Re: Handcuffs

PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 10:19 pm
by IX_Legion
aoffan23 wrote:
The 2010 Rules wrote:Under an intelligent minifig’s direction, the Creature may act as intelligently as if it had a full Mind, but if abandoned, the Creature reverts to whatever animal-like behavior seems appropriate: milling around aimlessly, running and hiding, or attacking everything in sight. If another intelligent minifig can catch a masterless Creature, regardless of whether he’s on the same team, the Creature accepts him as its new master.


This is perfect for when people are. When the captor is there, they control the captive. When the captor is dead or gone, the captive runs toward freedom. When an ally is with the captive, they can attempt to free them. I guess the roll for breaking handcuffs could just be a WISG roll.


Would this not be better?

The 2010 Rules wrote:Subjugated Creatures are restrained or harnessed and forced to cooperate against their will. They may be completely intelligent, but have Half a Mind to break free and run amuck. As long as they are kept in their restraints, they must follow the orders of their captors, but if they can be released, they will do whatever they can to prevent being enslaved again. This usually means attacking their captors or fleeing the battlefield, but can also be as simple as just attacking everything in sight, regardless of allegiance.


If they're cuffed and the captors are nearby, they're good little prisoners, but if they get the chance they can try to break their restraints and escape and/or kill their captors. I guess it's about the same thing, but I think the "Subjugated" creature is designed with this situation in mind, while the "Submissive" creature is one that really doesn't care that it's being controlled/doesn't have the intelligence/willpower to resist.