Military LEGO Theme(s)?

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Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:06 pm

I'm hoping to get some discussion going on this topic.

Officially, The LEGO Group's word on this is:
The LEGO Group wrote:We have a strict policy regarding military models, and therefore, we do not produce tanks, helicopters, etc. While we always support the men and women who serve their country, we prefer to keep the play experiences we provide for children in the realm of fantasy.


I also read a rumor that LEGO's founder, Ole Kirk Christiansen had such a distaste for war that for a long time he forbade his company to make green bricks, for fear that boys would use them to make tanks.

Despite this, we've seen missile-equipped fighter jets...
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Armored Assault Helicopters (reminiscent of the Soviet Mi-24 Hind)
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And a bunch of other stuff that I'm not able to post due to technical difficulties, but that also includes SAM sites, Soviet and Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei Wehrmacht war machines (from the Indiana Jones themes), the much-loved Toy Story Army Men & Jeep, and a freaking military Chinook helicopter for law-enforcement use.
:shock: (LEGO City is a pants-pissingly frightening Orwellian police state.)

There are many arguments I've see both for and against Military LEGO Theme:

Against: LEGO shouldn't do it because it would glorify war for kids, and is especially insensitive to children in war-torn countries. Also, what nations' militaries would be represented? Besides, AFOLS for whom war-themes are age-appropriate typically have the skill to build their own military LEGO.

For: LEGO should do it because many of the kids who grew up with LEGO are now adults and the market demands more mature set themes. Also, stick a "ages 18+" label on the box, and don't market it to war-torn countries. As for what hardware is represented, make it either generic green-vs.-tan Army-Men or market specific vehicles to specific countries (America gets the F16s, Russia gets the MiGs, etc).

So tell me, Brikwars forum, what do you think?
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Zupponn » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:40 pm

I think that Lego also has a no gun policy. Oops.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Tzan » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:44 pm

Any big organization like:
Companies
Religions
Political parties

They all have a pro hypocrisy policy.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:21 pm

Zupponn wrote:I think that Lego also has a no gun policy. Oops.


Nope, LEGO had minifig guns way back in the old Pirate and Wild West sets (I forget which came first). It was part of their "recognizing the need for kids to explore aggression through role-play" or something like that.

Interestingly enough, LEGO made toy guns before they made plastic briks.
Behold:

Image

Apparently it made a rat-a-tat noise when you turned the crack.

Y'know, like real guns do./sarcasm
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby IVhorseman » Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:14 pm

Clearly we don't need permission from LEGO to build these things ourselves - for fuck's sake we play brikwars. I think all the people who are demanding military sets are just not creative enough to make them on their own. There's nobody stopping you from doing it, so go ahead and build your tanks. LEGO won't have to promote violence and you still get your tanks - it's a win/win for both of us.

The biggest reason LEGO doesn't make tanks is because they don't need to. We'll keep buying bricks to make em ourselves and they know that.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Zupponn » Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:50 pm

I actually prefer that they don't make tanks. It's much cooler to see them produce awesome crazy stuff like what's in the Ninjago or Chima lines. To me, it shows kids that they really can build anything that they can think of, rather than just things that exist IRL.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:01 pm

Tzan wrote:Any big organization like:
Companies
Religions
Political parties

They all have a pro hypocrisy policy.


I think a more accurate statement would be to say that big organizations tend to have a lot of different people in them, each with their own varying beliefs, agendas, and ideas on how the organization should do things and what the group's tenets should be.

For example, people typically refer to "government" (I'll pick on the gov't, since prettty much everyone resents some aspect of it, and as a Libertarian, I get to make fun of both Dems and Reps) as is it were one big monolithic entity, rather than made up of myriad personnel and agencies at federal, state/province, county, city, and local levels, often working at cross-purposes (like the state governments that stood up to Obama's unconstitutional gun control act).

Still, it's true that you inevitably get some individuals within such groups may be hypocrites themselves (Congressmen passing Obamacare while exempting themselves from being under it) or policies that are hypocritical (Bush's "Patriot Act" justified as "if you're not a terrorist, you should have nothing to hide" while the government fails at transparency itself).

However, at the same time, a huge majority of people in a given group are there with sincere motives - making money as in a company, bettering themselves spiritually in a religion, or serving their respective country in a government. Notice I said "sincere", not necessarily "moral" or "just".

But I digress...
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Silverdream » Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:24 pm

Kirillyos wrote:
Zupponn wrote:I think that Lego also has a no gun policy. Oops.


Nope, LEGO had minifig guns way back in the old Pirate and Wild West sets (I forget which came first). It was part of their "recognizing the need for kids to explore aggression through role-play" or something like that.

Interestingly enough, LEGO made toy guns before they made plastic briks.
Behold:

Image

Apparently it made a rat-a-tat noise when you turned the crack.

Y'know, like real guns do./sarcasm



As I remember, those guns were made to celebrate Denmark's liberation from German Occupation. Lego is one of the few companies I trust and respect (the others being McDonald's and Brickarms) so I will agree with whatever they end up doing.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:50 am

IVhorseman wrote:Clearly we don't need permission from LEGO to build these things ourselves - for fuck's sake we play brikwars. I think all the people who are demanding military sets are just not creative enough to make them on their own. There's nobody stopping you from doing it, so go ahead and build your tanks. LEGO won't have to promote violence and you still get your tanks - it's a win/win for both of us.

The biggest reason LEGO doesn't make tanks is because they don't need to. We'll keep buying bricks to make em ourselves and they know that.


Well, maybe not "tanks" per se... but armored, treaded vehicles with large, turret-mounted cannons/launchers?

Image

Zupponn wrote:I actually prefer that they don't make tanks. It's much cooler to see them produce awesome crazy stuff like what's in the Ninjago or Chima lines. To me, it shows kids that they really can build anything that they can think of, rather than just things that exist IRL.


I do like those themes - treads, missiles, and all sorts of other fun stuff, event though I couldn't care less about whatever backstory. Of course with the "LEGO can produce whatever they want, and we can build whatever we want out of it" argument, you have to consider that the type of sets manufactured influence the type of elements available, and that influences the type of things that can be built from it. People creamed their pants over the Toy Story Army Men set not because "omgz, toy story is the shiz!" but because "omgz, realistic, green army helmets! Finally!"

Like I said, I care not for the backstory of Ninjago or Chima (I think it's like Redwall with rocket launchers), but value the sets for the copious amount of ninjas and elements that lend themselves well to building military vehicles.

I agree with IVhorseman - LEGO gets to have their good rep from making a kid-friendly fantasy story with anthropomorphic animal-warriors and dizzy ninjas, and we get to use the treads, OD-green pieces, and missile launchers to rebuild them into military vehicles.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:53 am

Tzan wrote:Any big organization like:
Yadda...

They all have a pro hypocrisy policy.


So back to the point I was trying to make: I don't think it's so much hypocrisy on LEGO's part as adapting with the times. The founder has been dead for some time now, and new leaders get to shift company policy into more lucrative (and often awesome) directions. Would you like it if there were no LEGO guns or green bricks?

Edit: Technically, the Agents, Alpha Team and such are all paramilitary, the Indy Jones/Superhero/Toy Story sets are licensed from a 3rd-party property that LEGO had no control over, Dino-whatever themes are technically big-game-hunting (man-vs-dino, rather than man-vs-man), and the police sets (albeit militarized) are just that - law-enforcement. The LEGO Group may frequently flirt with the line (and we don't mind), but they have yet to completely cross it.
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Zahru II » Tue Jun 04, 2013 3:08 am

I'm pretty sure that gun could be rebuilt by lego today, it bears an uncanny resemblance to a MOC. It's like a message to the future: we didn't have the tech to build it, but you shall!
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Insert_blank » Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:02 am

Kirillyos wrote:For example, people typically refer to "government" (I'll pick on the gov't, since prettty much everyone resents some aspect of it, and as a Libertarian, I get to make fun of both Dems and Reps)


:dog: Please tell me more about your libertarian views and your strange ability to make fun of both dems and reps?
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Tue Jun 04, 2013 9:37 am

Insert_blank wrote:
Kirillyos wrote:For example, people typically refer to "government" (I'll pick on the gov't, since prettty much everyone resents some aspect of it, and as a Libertarian, I get to make fun of both Dems and Reps)


:dog: Please tell me more about your libertarian views and your strange ability to make fun of both dems and reps?


Ooooh, sarcasm and memes! Someone's johnny-on-the-spot with picking up the new trends! Better tell all your myspace buddies about it, it'll be rad!
LEGO are like boobs - designed for kids, but adults have plenty of fun playing with them too. ;)
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Kirillyos » Tue Jun 04, 2013 9:43 am

Zahru II wrote:I'm pretty sure that gun could be rebuilt by lego today, it bears an uncanny resemblance to a MOC. It's like a message to the future: we didn't have the tech to build it, but you shall!


I know, right? Just Google "LEGO Gun MOC" and there are plenty of LEGO guns sized for humans that come up - including some pretty awesome ones like the rubber band gatling gun.
LEGO are like boobs - designed for kids, but adults have plenty of fun playing with them too. ;)
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Re: Military LEGO Theme(s)?

Postby Ben-Jammin » Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:12 pm

Kirillyos wrote:
Insert_blank wrote:
Kirillyos wrote:For example, people typically refer to "government" (I'll pick on the gov't, since prettty much everyone resents some aspect of it, and as a Libertarian, I get to make fun of both Dems and Reps)


:dog: Please tell me more about your libertarian views and your strange ability to make fun of both dems and reps?


Ooooh, sarcasm and memes! Someone's johnny-on-the-spot with picking up the new trends! Better tell all your myspace buddies about it, it'll be rad!


:tiger:
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