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Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:35 pm
by IVhorseman
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:36 pm
by IVhorseman
Usable feedback:
anon wrote:Examples:
Measuring inches is slow and precise. Break the board into the regions and just move between them. Melee attacks against anyone in your region, ranged attacks across regions. Done. Just sped up the game by 50%.
Target Size: Really, I'm going to stop the middle of combat to measure how tall your character appears from my character's perspective? Just give large characters a flat armor penalty and small characters a bonus. Also, I hope you remember whether or not that unit moved last turn and how far. Give me a break. We have no hitpoints because it's too much bookkeeping, but I'm supposed to remember the full last turn of movements at all times?
Counter-Attacks & Parrying: Fuck off with this shit. Let me try to hit you with my sword without us both having to roll four times.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:36 pm
by IVhorseman
anon wrote:Charge Attacks: Five (5) [FIVE!!!!] pages of rules JUST FOR THIS! We're measuring momentum? Fucking hell. +1 bonus on your damage roll if you moved into the attack with a straight line of movement. DONE.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 8:38 pm
by IVhorseman
anon wrote:>I don't like the rules therefore the rules should change
It's like you didn't even bother to read them. It tells you to ignore what you don't like.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:21 pm
by Silverdream
I do like his ideas, they do seem like they speed up the game and I've never really used momentum.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:12 am
by stubby
I just uploaded a bunch of the changes I've been working on over the past month or two.
(Updated chapters: Title, 3, 4, 5, H, 7, 9; the majority of the work has been going into 8 but it's not ready for upload yet.)
I've been gradually chipping away at Momentum, it shouldn't be too complicated until you get to the big creations now. The versions in chapter 5 and H have been pared down to easy versions for minifigs and horses.
Reducing the damage bonus if your minifig gets hit by a falling apartment complex to a simple "+1" doesn't seem like a good solution to me, so I ignored that idea. The idea is fine for a game that's just minifigs and horses, but I think he doesn't get the scope we're going for here.
I got rid of attack penalties for movement. The fa/tg/uy is right, they aren't worth the amount of trouble they cost.
Not sure if I have anything to say about his opinion of Counters. I understand if some people think they bog things down; I think the game is pretty flat without them.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:02 am
by Quantumsurfer
He later apologizes for "being an asshat," saying he has too much respect for the craft of designing a game to have behaved badly.
As for his ideas...well...
IVhorseman wrote:Usable feedback:
anon wrote:Examples:
Measuring inches is slow and precise. Break the board into the regions and just move between them. Melee attacks against anyone in your region, ranged attacks across regions. Done. Just sped up the game by 50%.
Target Size: Really, I'm going to stop the middle of combat to measure how tall your character appears from my character's perspective? Just give large characters a flat armor penalty and small characters a bonus. Also, I hope you remember whether or not that unit moved last turn and how far. Give me a break. We have no hitpoints because it's too much bookkeeping, but I'm supposed to remember the full last turn of movements at all times?
Counter-Attacks & Parrying: Fuck off with this shit. Let me try to hit you with my sword without us both having to roll four times.
Hatred. Oh, hey, I've got an idea. How about you get all your legos out and I get all my legos out. Then you flip a coin and I'll call heads or tails. If I call it right, i fucking win. Then we put our legos away. Boom, done, just sped up the game 1000%.
I don't understand how the second one is a big deal to anyone. I have an understanding of the size of things before the game starts. Why is there stopping again? Though there is something (I'm not sure how much) to be said about the difficulty of tracking multiple things from turn to turn.
stubby wrote:Not sure if I have anything to say about his opinion of Counters. I understand if some people think they bog things down; I think the game is pretty flat without them.
The game is absolutely flat without them. That said, they can be unwieldy. I don't, for example, bother overmuch with the minutiae of the angry inch.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:48 am
by stubby
Quantumsurfer wrote:He later apologizes for "being an asshat," saying he has too much respect for the craft of designing a game to have behaved badly.
I'm pretty sure that he realized that if he carried out his threat of publishing his own Lego wargame "within the week" or whatever, he'd lose anon and have to answer for asshattery.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:00 pm
by Whiteagle
A kid is trying to shill some other wargame he found...
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:35 pm
by IVhorseman
anon wrote:>The Fudge it Rule
>If a player tries to follow all of them to the letter, their turns will take hours, everyone will lose interest, and no one will want to play a
second time.
this here is where i stopped actually reading the thing and just skimmed through it. any ruleset that says it is overly complicated and tells the player that its best to not use most of the rules admits defeat. you can make normal and advanced rules if you really like, but don't go making rules so shit that you have to tell players not to follow them!
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:52 pm
by IVhorseman
Whiteagle wrote:A kid is trying to shill some other wargame he found...
http://i.4cdn.org/tg/src/1392075197870.pdf
It's also terrible. Not sure how he finds this less constraining than Brikwars in any way shape or form.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:12 pm
by stubby
IVhorseman wrote:anon wrote:this here is where i stopped actually reading the thing and just skimmed through it. any ruleset that says it is overly complicated and tells the player that its best to not use most of the rules admits defeat. you can make normal and advanced rules if you really like, but don't go making rules so shit that you have to tell players not to follow them!
Working as intended: making rules so shit-players won't play them
This sounds like exactly the guy the rules were designed to keep far the fuck away from me or anyone else who's fun to play games with.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:05 am
by Theblackdog
As a vehicle player I have to say I liked the accuracy penalty for target speed -- a lot of the attacks aimed at vehicles would basically auto-hit otherwise, and it encouraged maneuvering because an attack from the front or rear ignored the accuracy penalty.
That said my weapons tend to be more accurate than those in the rulebook -- URs rarely rise above 5 or 6. So I can see how this is a good idea if you're playing with stock weapons.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:51 am
by IVhorseman
What if super-fast flimsy vehicles had a static bonus based off of their maximum speed? Basically assume something's moving at either max speed, or none.
Re: Live thread on /tg/
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 11:23 am
by stubby
I thought that's what everyone did anyway