Whiteagle wrote:It'd be like a Death Star with no Exhaust Port; An unfun super weapon that doesn't blow up if hit just right, but instead either needs to be slagged via a huge conventional attack or faced with an equal or greater super weapon.
Which makes it no different than an SHDT with no SN dice. But there are no creations like that in BrikWars; every propulsion system and exterior weapon is an exhaust port as far as component damage is concerned.
Really, you're going to have to convince me that the problems of tying SN dice to elements is worse in some way than not tying them to elements. The problems you describe with the SHDT are not any better if I make it so that the SN dice can't be affected and stolen by enemies at all, rather than just being somewhat difficult to affect and steal.
stubby wrote:It doesn't take an Action to pick up dropped equipment. If your enemy knocks off your SN elements without a follow-up plan to take advantage of it, then that's his own fault.
Still, that would just lead to a game of keep away; Either the enemy outright destroys said Elements or keeps you chasing after them if they can't recover them for themselves.
Thus, such Elements are not only NOT BEING USED, they are actively detracting from the bloodshed (even if this does contribute to the mayhem).
Like I said, it doesn't take an action to pick them up. If they knock them off and you pick them up again, they're being used just as much. It hasn't even slowed you down.
If they knock them off and they
pick them up, then they're being used just as much.
If they destroy them, then they're not being used any less than if they'd just used their attack to kill you instead.
But I don't really see that happening most of the time. Most of the time, I expect that enemies aren't going to target your SN elements at all. They're going to kill you, and then loot the SN from your corpse. Which means the SN will get used way more than if they all just disappear when you die.
Whiteagle wrote:This also still unfairly favors Creations over Minifigs.
By this logic, there's not a weapon or system in the whole game that doesn't unfairly favor Creations over minifigs. Should we remove creations entirely?
stubby wrote:Well I should hope so! That's how a SHDT would be built in real life, don't you think? I'd be kind of disappointed otherwise.
Well then we end up getting into what I just mentioned; Nofun Super Weapon Creations that are encrusted in bricks and armor that use their SN Cores for everything else.
You'd basically have to blast your way to the Core to access those SN Elements, and if you can amass the firepower to do that why not kill the Creation outright?
Indeed! Why wouldn't you kill the Creation outright, and then take the SN elements as your just reward? This makes the game more awesome as far as I'm concerned.
Whiteagle wrote:Well the idea here is to play on the Anoraks' own abuse of Averages.
With the current Fumble system, he'd be dolling out small Force shocks and buffs, since you can only sabotage those Fumbled Dice that turn.
Yeah, limiting the sabotage is important. That way (except in very, very rare cases where all the dice fumble at once) the fumble dice are only decreasing the SN dice's positive advantage to the active player, rather than becoming a completely unearned asset to the shit passive player.
I don't think I can impress upon you enough how far I'm willing to go out of my way to prevent the "emperor blows himself up without the shit player having to do anything" result. That is a game-ruining nightmare.
Whiteagle wrote:Karmic Dice, however, throw a wrench into all of this, as ALL the Fumbled Dice could be collected and then spend as the Anorak's opponent sees fit
This is never going to be something I want to happen. I like the idea of the opponent getting those dice to spend, but only if he does the work to get them. He should never be able to get them without working.
Players need to feel like they're achieving their victories through their own efforts or there's no point in playing the game. And the converse, if players feel like other people are handed victories for doing nothing, it makes all the victories they put in work and effort towards feel just as stupid and worthless as the shit player's.
Whiteagle wrote:SNOPs would be better off GOING BIG and dealing with minor complications, even if said complications turn their huge SN Dice Pools against them, while huge SN Lowbies forces really have to think twice about using Supernatural Powers to doll out a large number of small generic buffs.
I don't want SN units thinking twice. It sucks to give players a cool toy and then make it so they won't want to use it. I want it to be potentially hilarious, but still always better to attempt to use than not to.