BW 2010 feedback

[stubby]

This little guy has been with us from the very basic parts of the game back in chapter 2, and still if I try to build his stats point-by-point with the creature system, he fits in nice and consistently. And that makes me happy.

Yeah, but that's because I designed the creature system costs to match him, not the other way around.

The problem with CP is that it's designed for earlier versions of BrikWars, where the mechanics were balanced around the amount of specific combat materiel, with minifigs being treated as just another type of materiel. As BrikWars evolved over the years, the line between combat materiel and random battlefield material blurred to the point that there was essentially no difference (making it some weird hybrid materiæl, I guess?). Assuming you've built a decent battlefield, a minifig can show up with no equipment whatsoever and still make a decent run with the objects and items he finds at hand.

Reflecting this, the game's internal balancing mechanics shifted away from materiel base and towards an executive base - how many actors you have on the field and the magnitude of what they can accomplish per turn. A guy with 500 weapons has a slight advantage over a guy with one weapon, but they can both still only do one guy's worth of things on any given turn. CP doesn't reflect what's actually valuable or meaningful under the current rules system, so it's hard for me to get all that excited about whether a team's budget is off by 5 or 10%.

[Tzan]

Reflecting this, the game's internal balancing mechanics shifted away from materiel base and towards an executive base - how many actors you have on the field and the magnitude of what they can accomplish per turn. A guy with 500 weapons has a slight advantage over a guy with one weapon, but they can both still only do one guy's worth of things on any given turn. CP doesn't reflect what's actually valuable or meaningful under the current rules system, so it's hard for me to get all that excited about whether a team's budget is off by 5 or 10%.

This is exactly what I was thinking when I first read the cp system back in 2008.
And why I thought is was all messed up. I don't recall if I mentioned it more than once, because it was there and people used it, so why rock the boat.
I like cp, it just needs to be scaled properly to reflect the effect an item has on the field.

[Valiant]

I posted about this years ago.
I looked great once but now its just broken.



FF 36.0.4
If I use the vert slider and it comes into view (as you would normally use the page) you see the image I posted.
If I resize the window sideways you can see the part of the intended image.

What is the original image?

[Tzan]

http://brikwars.com/rules/2010/mc.htm

Go there, scroll down and find out.
It seems to only be broken on my machine.
Like Unity 5.0 disables the internet on about 1% of users machines.
Hopefully fixed in Unity 5.1 in two weeks.

[Valiant]

So one hero could possibly wipe out an entire M-Throne army... with just a couple feats? Or am I stretching the limits of the reality that is Brikwars.

[Zupponn]

So one hero could possibly wipe out an entire M-Throne army... with just a couple feats?

Yes.

[RedRover]

So one hero could possibly wipe out an entire M-Throne army... with just a couple feats? Or am I stretching the limits of the reality that is Brikwars.

Crazed sourcerers summoning meteors or burly Vikings making earthquakes with their war hammers.

[Valiant]

Stubby, would you like some help for completing chapter eleven?

[Valiant]

Stubby, when will Chapter Eleven: "Armies" be completed?

[Blitzen]

Stubby, when will Chapter Eleven: "Armies" be completed?

BrikWars 2010 will be completed in 2010, obviously.

[Keldoclock]

You just have to wait until the calendar rolls over.

[stubby]

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13265

[Whiteagle]

I like cp, it just needs to be scaled properly to reflect the effect an item has on the field.

Agreed, I can sorta see what Mike is trying to do, but it doesn't require the complete removal of Construction Points...

I'm not trying to be a Munchkin, or Anorak, or elitist 40Ker who wants to keep out the more causal gamers. I like to build cool-looking units first, and then give them special stats to match, not the other way around. And just like the system shouldn't force out the casual gamers who pull out a handful of random figs 5 minutes before the start of the game, it shouldn't force out the more interested players who put time and effort into building up elaborate armies.

I think this hobby can be flexible enough to accommodate anyone who wants to play, as long as everyone at the table is having fun.

I'll have to take another look at that "Alternative to CP" thing, which seems to take action-economy into consideration.

Maybe CP just needs a revision, instead of being entirely thrown out, we'll have to see.

Yeah Mike, it's clear you want to Burn the Neckbeard, Kill the Gonard, and Purge the Netlister, but you have to understand that the CP system makes specialization an option IN THE FIRST PLACE!
The best Brikwars unit right now is the "Basic Assault Troop," a dude with a Pistol in one hand and a Knife in the other, because that is the cheapest all-rounder that can fuck most shit up.
If weapons don't have any cost, what's to keep people from just making Riflemen to gun down any threat?
Without CP, there is nothing to encourage variation, as things will default to the most optimized options via natural selection.

Yeah, I mean, despite its occasional shortcomings, CP does still mostly work - for now, at least. And there are plenty of us that are still satisfied with it. Or at least not dissatisfied to the point of jumping into a radical revision or something completely new. Better the devil you know, than the angel you don't I guess.

Indeed...
Honestly I don't have much faith in what I've read of the Inch system; It seems to focus far too much on Action Economy, which would favor the person who uses their Inches entirely for Mini-figs over Constructions, then has to have a simplified Construction Point system stapled to it.

So what are some things we can do to help CP catch up to how the rest of Brikwars has evolved?

I don't know...

[stubby]

Yeah Mike, it's clear you want to Burn the Neckbeard, Kill the Gonard, and Purge the Netlister, but you have to understand that the CP system makes specialization an option IN THE FIRST PLACE!

What!!! Oh my god! If only I'd spent literally the past twenty years developing the CP system from scratch so I might have known its purpose and functions!

It's weird, but lately I've noticed that the only times you say stuff in ALL CAPS is when you're telling somebody they don't know about something that they're actually an expert in. But what you don't realize is that your mom HELPS PEOPLE WITH THEIR TAXES

[Whiteagle]

Yeah Mike, it's clear you want to Burn the Neckbeard, Kill the Gonard, and Purge the Netlister, but you have to understand that the CP system makes specialization an option IN THE FIRST PLACE!

What!!! Oh my god! If only I'd spent literally the past twenty years developing the CP system from scratch so I might have known its purpose and functions!

It's weird, but lately I've noticed that the only times you say stuff in ALL CAPS is when you're telling somebody they don't know about something that they're actually an expert in. But what you don't realize is that your mom HELPS PEOPLE WITH THEIR TAXES

Mike, your entire damn Inch system revolves around Action Economy; Weapons don't cost anything, just the number of Actors you have available.
This makes larger Creations a statistically worse choice to bring, as they eat up Inches you could otherwise divided into more Actors and thus more Actions per turn!

That would create an environment perfect for Asteriosi...